USA legalizes gay marriage

Klaatu said:

How cool is this?

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As a proud American, I applaud this couple. Sad, in many respects, that they had to wait 54 years to have their right to marriage acknowledged, but, good for them for exercising their rights and marrying. Only thing I can think about the wait is that now that they waited so long, it might be sweeter (in the same way that a drink of water when you are thirsty matters more than when you are not).

Good for them. Hope they enjoy their married life and their freedom.

jadmperry said:

Only thing I can think about the wait is that now that they waited so long, it might be sweeter (in the same way that a drink of water when you are thirsty matters more than when you are not).

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On their honeymoon they might get thirsty.

Brad said:

It's fox news but: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2014...-who-refuse-to-perform-same-sex-weddings.html

I can cite more. It hasn't been the churches directly yet but we've seen multiple lawsuits against: bakers, people that hold weddings on private property, and those that run businesses related to weddings that oppose gay marriage on religious beliefs. Fire up google and start searching around, if you do you'll see multiple cases of this going on over the last three years or so. A lot of them have been happening in the UK as of late.

As for your second point: I break the law all of the time on personal beliefs and you should too. Every person in the nation that has smoked cannabis has broken a law that goes against federal law even if they live in a state where cannabis is "legal". I drink corn liquor all of the time, know several that make it, those people do it because they feel the Government has no right to dictate what they do on their own land or put into their own body.

As I said before I'm not against gay marriage. I am against 9 non-elected people dictating the laws of the land that the people of the land are supposed to follow. This is why I don't respect federal law any more. I respect state law outside of the war on drugs and a few other issues, issues that only came about because the Feds **** all over the Constitution on a daily basis.

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First: Did you even read that article? It wasn't registered as a church, it was registered as a for-profit business. Had it been registered as a church and a non-profit, there would not be an issue.

Second: You also need to study your Schoolhouse Rock a bit more. The Justices aren't "non-elected" they are indirectly elected. The President gets elected and they nominate a candidate to the Supreme Court who is then voted on by the Senate... a body that is elected.

Third: You seem to be objecting to the Supreme Court doing its constitutionally mandated role. Its job is to interpret the law and strike down those that are unconstitutional. The same-sex marriage bans were found unconstitutional on the Equal Protections clause of the 14th amendment, though there are other reasons to strike them down as well. The Supreme Court did not create any law here, they simply said to the states that if they are going to issue marriage licences to couples, they have to issue them regardless of the gender of the applicants....no special treatment for couples that are opposite gender.

Love is love, no matter what and everyone should let it be.

Morganna said:

I'm sorry, what? There is only one context - that of "once you go black" meaning that once you've slept with a black person, you'll never look at any other race/colour again because they're the best. Ummm... that's racist - there is no other context.

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Touche. But I mean context as in - are you oppressing someone with the racist statement.
My intent was not to oppress. Some people will use the phrase, their intent to oppress - But I didn't.

jadmperry said:

AND.....all of this makes me somewhat despair. When we sharpshoot each other, make some points or statements that are not perfectly politically correct or get into pedantic arguments, where are we?

Hate to invoke this: Can't we get along? ( previously thought it was stated as "Can't we all just get along," but hearing the words, I think I quoted it correctly).

This might be a stretch. I might be wrong. Maybe I am defending the indefensible.

Here I go:

Strictly speaking, "once you go black, you will never go back," is racist. Why? It is, by definition, a statement based on race. Has anyone EVER suffered from some oppression or negative impact based on this statement? Kinda doubt it (except for my 9th girlfriend who got really offended that I may have engaged in congress with a young lady of African descent and was bothered by that... ironically, she later dated a Jamaican dude).

In spending way too much time thinking about what I am writing before I write it.....I think my point is, really, who cares? Are people often racist? Yep. Is some of it non-conscious? Yep. Is some of it not directly harmful to others? Yep. Is some of it conscious and harmful? Yep. Would the world be better if there was no racism? Yep.

Come on. Really, are we getting our jimmies rustled by "Once you go black, you never go back"?

How about this. Jacq admits this is racist and Morganna admits this is not a point that matters much. We all agree that racism exists, it is much more serious in impact to black folks, none of this can fix this on our own, arguing about minor points or "micro-aggressions" seems to separate us more than unite us.....

Or, we can just sharpshoot each other, not respect each other, point out petty differences, not extend respect, courtesy and forgiveness to each other and make it a "tit-for-tat," continuing fight for....well forever.

How about, we just be nice to each other, acknowledge that there will be slips, that maybe black folks who are a little bit tongue in cheek proud or joking about things are maybe due a bit of slack....

Nah, sorry, I know my post was stupid....We should just take up hard positions, point fingers at each other, and make the world a crappier place.

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HERE HERE! Great post.
I'll admit that I've got one of the foulest mouths you're likely to ever encounter. I say racist **** all the time. Not as an oppressive weapon - but as comedic relief. Much like one of my favorite insult comics Lisa Lampanelli. She, in the spirit of equality, spreads it thickly, yet evenly.

Morganna said:

jadmperry we're not sharpshooting, we're just discussing. The point I was making really was that racism can be seen in anything should you wish to see it, regardless of whether it was meant that way or not. Personally, I just take everything at face value, I find the constant accusations of racism as a reason for everything tiresome - and I mean that in general, not on TAZ.

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Discussion is good! And I agree - you made a point. But it's semantics. Splitting hairs, trying to find something offensive in something who's intent was anything but offensive. Lisa - You posted on your TAZ profile a couple days ago, "Heh, some people need to get a sense of humour." --- I thought that's exactly what I was giving when I made my 'once you go Black' posts. And, ironically, it was taken a bit out of context by you. I'm sure you were only making a point... But I think in making it - you proved the point I was making: intent and context is EVERYTHING. You might be able to find racism in every crook, crevice and corner - if you're looking for it. But it all goes back to intent and context - Did the person making the comment mean it to be offensive and oppressive? We all read between the lines - and most of use are able to decipher between bad intent and good ones. Anyway - I'm rambling... I hope what I've said makes sense anyway....

Klaatu said:

How cool is this?

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It's EXTREMELY cool. I posted it to my FB page after crying happy tears in celebration of their love. They have been together for 54 years! It's an incredible feat that only a very small percentage of heterosexuals can boast. If they don't define what is all and good about the institution of marriage - I don't know what else can.

Oldsmoboi said:

First: Did you even read that article? It wasn't registered as a church, it was registered as a for-profit business. Had it been registered as a church and a non-profit, there would not be an issue.

Second: You also need to study your Schoolhouse Rock a bit more. The Justices aren't "non-elected" they are indirectly elected. The President gets elected and they nominate a candidate to the Supreme Court who is then voted on by the Senate... a body that is elected.

Third: You seem to be objecting to the Supreme Court doing its constitutionally mandated role. Its job is to interpret the law and strike down those that are unconstitutional. The same-sex marriage bans were found unconstitutional on the Equal Protections clause of the 14th amendment, though there are other reasons to strike them down as well. The Supreme Court did not create any law here, they simply said to the states that if they are going to issue marriage licences to couples, they have to issue them regardless of the gender of the applicants....no special treatment for couples that are opposite gender.

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Thanks for the inciteful analysis. I totally agree. Some folks think the court overstepped its bounds, going as far as to call the courts ruling a tyranical! I don't get it at all. I ask this ==> when is saying that all folks have the right to dignity EVER overstepping? And for the life of me - I cannot find any answer whatsoever. I applaud the court's ruling. They made the correct ruling and it is a boon towards the concept of a United States of America melting-pot of diversity!

J.

Yes will people please stop saying the Supreme Court "legislated from the bench." You don't even know what that means. It CORRECTLY applied the equal protection clause and set precedent - the door is open now for other such violations of it like affirmative action, quotas, welfare, you name it - to be overturned as well, as they should be. The 14th Amendment flat out says the government can't be picking winners and losers, cannot be passing out advantages or bennies to individuals or groups, that aren't available to ALL.

Anton Chigurh said:

Yes will people please stop saying the Supreme Court "legislated from the bench." You don't even know what that means. It CORRECTLY applied the equal protection clause and set precedent - the door is open now for other such violations of it like affirmative action, quotas, welfare, you name it - to be overturned as well, as they should be. The 14th Amendment flat out says the government can't be picking winners and losers, cannot be passing out advantages or bennies to individuals or groups, that aren't available to ALL.

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Obviously social media has blown up with conversation. A Facebook friend just made the following comment on one of my video posts. Ugh. I wish I could share the video here. It would most definitely enlighten. There's just too much vile language in it to post here. So... But yeah - Just had a friend post - and I quote:


The 'divorce is a very bad thing' comment was a total and complete cop-out to an earlier post which stated, "As for moral ramifications - Probably you should concern yourself with addressing the 51% divorce rate among heterosexuals - before daring to say the LGBT community is ruining the institution of marriage...?"

Anyway.... I was compelled to tell him, "Obviously the Supreme Court of the United States of America disagrees with you. Yay for all of humanity!"

I believe he hates me now LOL - The only thing is I can't give 2 ****s if he hates me - just don't make that hate an American policy! It's interesting - because he had the audacity to tell me that my 'lifestyle choice' is not at all an 'existence' and therefore is ineligible to own the dignity Justice Kennedy spoke of. You know what? **** HIM!

Tracy Perry said:

You do realize that is a two way street? And you were recently arguing to make it a one way only.

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Child please. I prefer 3-ways
Also - It was a discussion ..... until you came in and made it a debate. So please miss me with that BS
Love you just the same though.

J.

Tracy Perry said:

No debate to it.. was just indicating the hypocrisy of the statement. GFTGGFTG (acronym - will let you work on figuring it out )

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I can barely speak English -- No thanks to my K-12 teachers.. So what little English I've managed to teach myself does include the word acronym.
So - although I know its definition - I'll cordially bow out of the 'figuring it out' challenge. I've never been one to appreciate puzzles. They are tedious. Ironic - considering how puzzled I am at this very particular moment

In the spirit of enlightenment though - care to reveal what the hell GFTGGFTG is???? LOL
I mean - I even googled it. You've stumped Google dude!!

J.

Tracy Perry said:

Good for the Goose, Good for the Gander.

yes, it tells my age

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What about the gaggle though? Is it good for the gaggle? Folks often forget about the gaggle.
And the gaggle should never be forgotten about. For those of you who don't know what a gaggle is = TRUE! It's funny. But it's a multiple-bird joke.

J.

PoetJC said:

Discussion is good! And I agree - you made a point. But it's semantics. Splitting hairs, trying to find something offensive in something who's intent was anything but offensive. Lisa - You posted on your TAZ profile a couple days ago, "Heh, some people need to get a sense of humour." --- I thought that's exactly what I was giving when I made my 'once you go Black' posts. And, ironically, it was taken a bit out of context by you. I'm sure you were only making a point... But I think in making it - you proved the point I was making: intent and context is EVERYTHING. You might be able to find racism in every crook, crevice and corner - if you're looking for it. But it all goes back to intent and context - Did the person making the comment mean it to be offensive and oppressive? We all read between the lines - and most of use are able to decipher between bad intent and good ones. Anyway - I'm rambling... I hope what I've said makes sense anyway....

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I agree totally - and it's why I responded the way I did in the first place Was I offended by what you said? Hell no Did I actuallly find it racist? Nope, I didn't. I was basically showing how easy it is to cry racism - and your post above is exactly how people should look at things that are said. Unfortunately, it's not. The norm is to cry racism/oppression, etc regardless of the context.

Morganna said:

I agree totally - and it's why I responded the way I did in the first place Was I offended by what you said? Hell no Did I actuallly find it racist? Nope, I didn't. I was basically showing how easy it is to cry racism - and your post above is exactly how people should look at things that are said. Unfortunately, it's not. The norm is to cry racism/oppression, etc regardless of the context.

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The norm is to hollar RACISM when racism is actually employed.
Don't get me wrong - I've cried wolf on more than a few occasions. Certainly you have your race baiters like Reverend Sharpton and the like... They see racism in every corner as you have demonstrated = it can be found. They've lived racism and have earned the right to rabble rouse!

What's going on now - in my truly unbiased opinion - because I hear and respect other points of view - is "there they go again playing the race card" when there's not been play #1 even called. Sometimes society has it's blinders on; someone accused me earlier in a TAZ thread of seeing things through colored lenses (a horribly intentioned racist comment!) or some such - I told him I prefer beer goggles. But what I see going on now is an absolute dismissal that there is even a race problem.

Here in America, some of my friends have been so silent on the issues that have occurred just recently. In addition to the Charleston South Carolina massacre of 9 Black souls in a church - In addition to the confederate flag debate (how dare we not each agree that southern pride has absolutely nothing to do with bigotry, White supremacy and the right to enslave people - is beyond me!) - In addition to the gay marriage ruling.... THERE ARE BLACK CHURCHES BEING BURNT TO THE GROUND!

With all due respect - Ain't nobody crying racism when there's no need to cry it! How DARE anybody even insinuate such a thing in 2015 American when we're seeing in front of our faces is a defined disconnect! It's a disconnect of a lot of folks' brains from REALITY!

I often say that I myself live in a "bubble of oblivion" - it's one of my favorite phrases. But GIRL! To see some of the most educated people - people that I generally respect as substantial contributors to society... To see these people ACT as if their mind has taken leave of each and every one of their senses.... It's a sad statement on the state of humanity. Seriously. A bit depressing.

J.

PoetJC said:

The norm is to hollar RACISM when racism is actually employed.

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We'll have to agree to disagree, because

PoetJC said:

Ain't nobody crying racism when there's no need to cry it!

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I hate to break it to you, but that's exactly what you're doing here:-

PoetJC said:

someone accused me earlier in a TAZ thread of seeing things through colored lenses (a horribly intentioned racist comment!)

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Of course, you won't agree - and that's your right - but it is what it is

So anyway back to the gays...

Morganna said:

We'll have to agree to disagree, because



I hate to break it to you, but that's exactly what you're doing here:-


Of course, you won't agree - and that's your right - but it is what it is

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The dude told me that I was race baiting and seeing things through racially tinted glasses.
I was NOT!

J.

TJA said:

So anyway back to the gays...

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I surrender in the name of coloreds, the rainbow AND Judy Garland ...... AND the dude in the khaki pants .... YUM!
Okay. That was kinda racist - but definitely gay. More gay than racist. A swirl of the rainbow with Black & Whites if you will. In the name of diversity... Amen.

J.

PoetJC said:

The dude told me that I was race baiting and seeing things through racially tinted glasses.
I was NOT!

J.

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I'm not commenting on anything prior to that - just what you put in that one post

It's a circular argument really, and there are no winners because everyone wants to be right. Live and let live, I say.

You might like this though. My eldest daughter had to do a project on racism a little while ago. She had to depict a scene and thought long and hard over how to do it to get an impact. This is what she came up with:-

Morganna said:

I'm not commenting on anything prior to that - just what you put in that one post

It's a circular argument really, and there are no winners because everyone wants to be right. Live and let live, I say.

You might like this though. My eldest daughter had to do a project on racism a little while ago. She had to depict a scene and thought long and hard over how to do it to get an impact. This is what she came up with:-

View attachment 35471 View attachment 35472 View attachment 35473

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Naysayers justify racism at all costs whilst insisting to themselves that it does not even exist. Those naysayers are pie-in-the-sky folks indulging in delusion! With each new generation though... You know the saying. Time heals all wounds. I like to think your daughter's exhibit is an indication that we are no longer willing to TEACH our children bigotry. Racism, homophobia, trans-phobia, ageism, misogyny.... All these things are learned behaviors. Oh brave world when we cease to teach them! They are canker sores on the face of humanity.

But the thing is they ARE easy to spot. Perception, in more circumstances than not, is reality. 50-100 years ago - Americans perceived interracial marriages as undesirable. Such marriages were outright against the law. BANNED! No stamp of approval from the public. At. All ===> Fast forward to now - 2-3 generations later - 90% think mixed babies are beautiful LOL. And now - 61% of Americans (at last poll I've seen anyway) agree that the LGBT community should have access to marriage. The Supreme Court agrees and now it is law of the land.

3 cheers to the concept that time heals all wounds, as old canker sores on the face of humanity are buried 6-9 feet under and/or burned to cinders

J.

PoetJC said:

I like to think your daughter's exhibit is an indication that we are no longer willing to TEACH our children bigotry. Racism, homophobia, trans-phobia, ageism, misogyny

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Well, I can't speak for anyone else, but I've never taught my kids any of that. . and my parents never taught it to me . . and so on. But British here, and I've said before, that I think it's different here.

Morganna said:

But British here, and I've said before, that I think it's different here.

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You just need to look at the British chapter of Westboro Baptist Church to see that there is a bit of a difference.

Morganna said:

I'm sorry, what? There is only one context - that of "once you go black" meaning that once you've slept with a black person, you'll never look at any other race/colour again because they're the best. Ummm... that's racist - there is no other context.

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Oh, I've never heard it in that context. I've heard it in another context mostly but it was just out and around by random people, it was a Michael Jackson joke. Never had any "once you go black" thing said to me.